MN13 — The Longer Discourse on the Mass of Suffering
Thus have I heard:
At one time, the Blessed One was residing in Sāvatthī, in Jetas Grove, Anāthapiṇḍikas Park.
Then, several disciples, after dressing in the morning and taking their alms bowls and robes, entered Sāvatthī to seek alms. At that moment, these disciples thought, It is too early to go on alms round in Sāvatthī; what if we approach the park of the wanderers from other sects?
Then, those disciples approached the park of the wanderers from other sects. Having approached, they exchanged greetings with the wanderers, and after cordial exchanges, they sat down to one side.
While seated there, the wanderers addressed the disciples, saying, Friend, the ascetic Gotama expounds full understanding of sensual pleasures; we too proclaim the full understanding of sensual pleasures. The ascetic Gotama expounds full understanding of forms; we too proclaim the full understanding of forms. The ascetic Gotama expounds full understanding of feelings; we too proclaim the full understanding of feelings. In this regard, friends, what is the distinction, what is the difference, what is the unique quality between the ascetic Gotamas teaching and ours regarding the explanation of the doctrine and the instruction?
The disciples neither approved nor disapproved of the wanderers words. Not approving and not disapproving, they rose from their seats and departed with the thought, We shall learn the meaning of this speech in the presence of the Blessed One.
When those disciples had gone for alms in Sāvatthī and had finished their meal, they went to the Blessed One, paid homage to him, and sat down to one side. Once seated, those disciples recounted to the Blessed One what had happened:
Venerable sir, today after dressing in the morning and taking our alms bowls and robes, we entered Sāvatthī to seek alms. We thought, It is too early to go on alms round in Sāvatthī; what if we approach the park of the wanderers from other sects? So, we approached the park of the wanderers from other sects. Having approached, we exchanged pleasantries with them, and...
After engaging in friendly discourse and reflection, we sat quietly to one side. While we were seated, the wanderers of other sects addressed us, venerable sir: Friend, the ascetic Gotama teaches the complete understanding of sensual pleasures; we too teach the complete understanding of sensual pleasures. Friend, the ascetic Gotama teaches the complete understanding of forms; we too teach the complete understanding of forms. Friend, the ascetic Gotama teaches the complete understanding of feelings; we too teach the complete understanding of feelings. What, then, is the distinction, the essence, the specific difference between the teaching of the ascetic Gotama and ours regarding the instruction of the doctrine?
We neither approved nor disapproved of their words and, without expressing delight or contempt, we rose from our seats and departed, thinking: We shall comprehend the meaning of these words in the presence of the Blessed One.
Thus addressed, disciples, those wanderers of other sects should be asked: Friend, what is the gratification in sensual pleasures, what is their danger, what is the escape? What is the gratification in forms, what is their danger, what is the escape? What is the gratification in feelings, what is their danger, what is the escape?
Asked thus, disciples, the wanderers of other sects will not find satisfaction and will instead fall into further distress. What is the reason for that? Because, disciples, it is beyond their domain.
I do not see, disciples, anyone in the world, with its gods, its Māras, and its Brahmas, in this generation with its ascetics and brahmins, with its rulers and people, who could effectively respond to these questions, except for the Tathāgata or a disciple of the Tathāgata, or someone who has heard it from them.
What, disciples, is the gratification of sensual pleasures? There are these five strands of sensual pleasures. What are the five? Forms cognizable by the eye that are desirable, delightful, agreeable, pleasing, bound to sensuous desire, and enticing; sounds cognizable by the ear; odors cognizable by the nose; flavors cognizable by the tongue; tangibles cognizable by the body that are desirable, delightful, agreeable, pleasing, bound to sensuous desire, and enticing, these, disciples, are the five strands of sensual pleasures. Whatever joy and happiness arise dependent on these five strands of sensual pleasures, that is the gratification of sensual pleasures.
And, disciples, what is the danger in sensual pleasures? Here, disciples, a noble son earns a living through...
If by seal, by computation, by calculation, or by plowing, by trade, by cattle-herding, by archery, by royal service, by craftsmanship. Enduring cold, heat, contact with gadflies, mosquitoes, wind, sun, snakes, and creeping things, and being afflicted by hunger and thirst;
This, too, Disciples, is the visible disadvantage in sensual pleasures: the mass of suffering caused by sensual pleasures, brought about by sensual pleasures, arises because of sensual pleasures.
If, disciples, while striving, making effort, and exerting himself, the sons of good families do not attain wealth.
He grieves, grows weary, laments, beats his breast, and falls into confusion, saying:
Alas, my striving was in vain, my effort was fruitless.
This, too, Disciples, is the visible disadvantage in sensual pleasures: the mass of suffering caused by sensual pleasures, brought about by sensual pleasures, arises because of sensual pleasures.
If, disciples, while striving, making effort, and exerting himself, the sons of good families do attain wealth.
He perceives the suffering and distress involved in protecting that wealth:
How may my wealth not be taken away by kings, nor by thieves, nor consumed by fire, nor swept away by water, nor taken away by disagreeable heirs?
While guarding and protecting his wealth in this way, kings may seize it, thieves may seize it, fire may consume it, water may sweep it away, or disagreeable heirs may seize it.
He grieves, grows weary, laments, beats his breast, and falls into confusion, saying:
Even what I had is gone!
This, too, Disciples, is the visible disadvantage in sensual pleasures: the mass of suffering caused by sensual pleasures, brought about by sensual pleasures, arises because of sensual pleasures.
Further, Disciples, due to sensual pleasures, resulting from sensual pleasures, caused by sensual pleasures, even kings quarrel with kings, nobles with nobles, brahmins with brahmins, householders with householders, a mother with her son, a son with his mother, a father with his son, a son with his father, a brother with a brother, a brother with a sister, a sister with a brother, friends with friends.
Engaged in quarrel, brawl, dispute, they attack one another with fists, stones, sticks, or knives.
They suffer death or deadly pain.
Disciples, this too is a visible disadvantage in sensual pleasures, a mass of suffering due to sensual pleasures, originating from sensual pleasures, caused by sensual pleasures. Again, disciples, because of sensual pleasures, originating from sensual pleasures, caused by sensual pleasures, people take up sword and shield, don armor and bow, and, entering into battle, they engage with arrows raining down, spears thrown, and swords flashing. There, they are pierced by arrows, pierced by spears, and decapitated by swords. There, they meet with death, which is indeed suffering, simply death.
This too, disciples, is a visible disadvantage in sensual pleasures, a mass of suffering due to sensual pleasures, originating from sensual pleasures, caused by sensual pleasures. Again, disciples, because of sensual pleasures, originating from sensual pleasures, caused by sensual pleasures, people take up sword and shield, don armor and bow, and charge as warriors to confront the arrows being swiftly shot, spears being swiftly hurled, and swords gleaming. There, they are pierced by arrows, pierced by spears, and their bodies are trampled, and they are crushed, and decapitated by swords. There, they meet with death, which is indeed suffering, simply death.
This too, disciples, is a visible disadvantage in sensual pleasures, a mass of suffering due to sensual pleasures, originating from sensual pleasures, caused by sensual pleasures. Again, disciples, because of sensual pleasures, originating from sensual pleasures, caused by sensual pleasures, people cause divisions, they forcefully seize, they make one family dwell alone, they stand by the wayside, they become involved with others spouses. The rulers, capturing them, execute various punishments, they flog them with whips, flog them with rods, flog them with various instruments; they cut off their hands, cut off their feet, cut off their limbs, cut off their ears, cut off their noses, cut off both ears and nose; they make them into a mound of flesh, make them a clump of charred flesh, disfigure them into ghastly appearances, cover their bodies with burning wreaths, adorn them with blazing garments, tie them into wild growths, with ragged clothes, heap them with flesh, heap them with coins, carve them into cuts, encircle them with chains, position them on a pile of straw, immerse them with boiling oil, have them devoured by dogs, impale them alive on stakes, or execute them by decapitation with a sword.
They face death there, and even the thought of death is suffering. This too, disciples, is the immediate disadvantage of sensual pleasures, a mass of suffering due to sensual pleasures, originating from sensual pleasures, caused by sensual pleasures, and having sensual pleasures as the cause. Moreover, disciples, due to sensual pleasures, originating from sensual pleasures, caused by sensual pleasures, and having sensual pleasures as the cause, there is misconduct by body, speech, and mind. Having misbehaved by body, speech, and mind, upon the breakup of the body, after death, they are reborn in a state of woe, an unhappy destination, a place of downfall, in hell. This too, disciples, is the future disadvantage of sensual pleasures, a mass of suffering due to sensual pleasures, originating from sensual pleasures, caused by sensual pleasures, and having sensual pleasures as the cause.
And what, disciples, is the escape from sensual pleasures? Indeed, disciples, it is the removal and abandonment of desire and lust for sensual pleasures, this is the escape from sensual pleasures.
Disciples, whatever ascetics or brahmins do not know, as it truly is, the gratification as gratification, the danger as danger, and the escape as escape with respect to sensual pleasures, they will not themselves fully comprehend sensual pleasures, nor will they lead others to fully comprehend them so that they follow the path to fully comprehend sensual pleasures, this is not possible.
However, disciples, those ascetics or brahmins who know, as it truly is, the gratification as gratification, the danger as danger, and the escape as escape with respect to sensual pleasures, they will themselves fully comprehend sensual pleasures, or they will lead others to fully comprehend them so that they follow the path to fully comprehend sensual pleasures, this is possible.
And what, disciples, is the gratification in form? Just as, disciples, a noble maiden, a brahmin maiden, or a maiden of a householder, in the age of fifteen or sixteen, neither too tall nor too short, neither too thin nor too fat, neither too dark nor too fair, at that time, disciples, in prime beauty, she is considered exceedingly attractive. Yes, Venerable Sir. Whatever happiness and joy arise dependent upon beautiful and fair appearance, this is the gratification in form.
And what, disciples, is the danger in form? Here, disciples, one might see that very sister at another time, eighty, ninety, or a hundred years of age, aged, crooked like a rafter, bent, leaning on a staff, trembling, sick, having lost her youth, with broken teeth, gray hair, scanty hair, bald head, wrinkled, with blotches on her body.
What do you think, disciples, that previous form, beautiful and radiant in appearance, has disappeared, and a danger has manifested?
Yes, Venerable Sir.
This, too, is the danger in forms, disciples.
Again, disciples, one might see that same sister, afflicted, in pain, severely ill, lying in her own filth, reliant on others to help her, dependent on others to care for her.
What do you think, disciples, that previous form, beautiful and radiant in appearance, has disappeared, and a danger has manifested?
Yes, Venerable Sir.
This, too, is the danger in forms, disciples.
Again, disciples, one might see that same sisters body discarded in a charnel ground, one day dead, two days dead, or three days dead, bloated, discolored, festering.
What do you think, disciples, that previous form, beautiful and radiant in appearance, has disappeared, and a danger has manifested?
Yes, Venerable Sir.
This, too, is the danger in forms, disciples.
Again, disciples, one might see that same sisters body discarded in the charnel ground, being eaten by crows, being eaten by hawks, being eaten by vultures, being eaten by dogs, being eaten by jackals, being eaten by various other creatures.
What do you think, disciples, that previous form, beautiful and radiant in appearance, has disappeared, and a danger has manifested?
Yes, Venerable Sir.
This, too, is the danger in forms, disciples.
Again, disciples, one might see that same sisters body discarded in the charnel ground, a skeleton with some flesh and blood attached to it and held together by tendons, a skeleton smeared with flesh and blood and held together by tendons, a skeleton without flesh and blood and held together by tendons, the bones scattered in all directions, here a hand bone, there a foot bone, there a shin bone, there a thigh bone, here a hip bone, there a rib bone, here a back bone, here a breast bone, there a shoulder bone, here a neck bone, here a jawbone, here a tooth, there a skull.
What do you think, disciples, that previous form, beautiful and radiant in appearance, has disappeared, and a danger has manifested?
Yes, Venerable Sir.
This, too, is the danger in forms, disciples.
Again, disciples, he would see that same body cast aside in the charnel ground, bones white like shells, bones piled up three years old, rotting bones turned to powder. What do you think, disciples, has the former youthfulness with its beautiful complexion vanished, and has its danger appeared? Yes, venerable sir. This, too, disciples, is the danger in forms. And what, disciples, is the escape from forms? It is the fading away of, and the renunciation of, desire and lust for forms. This is the escape from forms.
Disciples, if any ascetics or brahmins do not know as it really is the gratification, the danger, and the escape with regards to forms, it is not possible that they themselves will fully comprehend forms or that they will instruct others so that they, following their instruction, will fully comprehend forms. But, disciples, if any ascetics or brahmins do know as it really is the gratification, the danger, and the escape with regards to forms, it is possible that they will fully comprehend forms themselves and instruct others so that they, following their instruction, will fully comprehend forms.
And what, disciples, is the gratification of feelings? Here, disciples, a disciple, secluded from sensual pleasures and unwholesome states, enters and dwells in the first jhāna, which is accompanied by applied and sustained thought, born of seclusion, filled with rapture and happiness. When, disciples, a disciple is thus secluded from sensual pleasures and unwholesome states, enters and dwells in the first jhāna, at that time he does not conceive aversion either towards himself, others, or both; he only experiences non-aversion at that time. I declare, disciples, that non-aversion is the highest gratification of feelings.
Furthermore, disciples, when the abating of applied and sustained thought leads to an internal confidence and unification of mind, free from applied and sustained thought, born of concentration, he enters and abides in the second jhāna... at any time when a disciple, with the fading away of rapture, dwells in equanimity, mindful and fully aware, feeling happiness with the body that the noble ones declare...
At the time, disciples, when a disciple, through the abandonment of pleasure and pain, and with the disappearance of former happiness and sadness, enters and dwells in the fourth jhāna, pure by equanimity and mindfulness, he does not intend harm to himself, does not intend harm to others, and does not intend harm to both. He experiences only the feeling that is free from affliction at that time. I declare, disciples, that freedom from affliction is the excellence of feelings.
And what, disciples, is the danger in feelings? It is that feelings are impermanent, painful, and subject to change, this is the danger in feelings.
And what, disciples, is the escape from feelings? It is the removal of desire and attachment to feelings, the abandonment of desire and attachment, this is the escape from feelings.
Disciples, if any ascetics or brahmins do not know, as it truly is, the gratification in feelings, the danger of feelings, and the escape from feelings, they are unable to fully comprehend feelings themselves or to instruct others so that one who practices in accordance will fully know feelings, this is not possible.
But if any ascetics or brahmins do know, as it truly is, the gratification in feelings, the danger of feelings, and the escape from feelings, they will be able to fully comprehend feelings themselves and to instruct others so that one who practices in accordance will fully know feelings, this is possible.
The Blessed One said this. Delighted, the disciples appreciated the Blessed Ones words.
The Discourse on the Great Mass of Suffering concludes here, the third.